I'm just saying, this sort of thing is what cost us Al Franken, one of the best and smartest senators EVER, due to an idiotic joke. Bad taste, maybe. Sexual harassment? No. Too high a price. 😕
I'll add 1961 President John F Kennedy urges American citizens to participate in public service and "ask not what your country can do for you--ask what you can do for your country.
I'd hazard a guess that I'm at least as well traveled as "Clown Boy" and because I'm also a lifelong student of history I know that he's totally missing the point.
Clown Boy and that idiot who trashed Ms Ocasio-Cortez' perfect response to the Adderall v Ketamine Battle Royale seem to not understand a basic truth about strongman authoritarians (though for Their Donald "strong" needs to be in air quotes). The best and most effective way to resist them is through ridicule. They're fragile, profoundly insecure extremely vulnerable to ridicule.
In the short term, they'll flail about trying to break shit but in the long run, they prove that they are, I'm fact, clowns — and all you need is to let's a critical mass of the populace see it and boom! Their support evaporates.
This is how we neuter Trump — and we need to get on it before the Mid-Term election because a Democrat majority Congress is the best shield against Trump and his childish destruction.
I completely agree. Trump cannot stand to be mocked for a reason - he knows the power of humor. That's why I love the TACO memes. Exposing his buffoonery for what it is - the ramblings of a mad king - strips away his power.
Trump is a clown from the evil circus. Americans are suckers for this kind of show business. For Democrats to win they need to speak simple language people understand, don’t exaggerate small things like trans gender and don’t look down on someone less educated. Respect people who voted for Trump and work patiently with them to turn the tide. Maybe be a good clown with big heart vs bad cruel clown, would it work? We have to try in earnest.
Clown is as Clown does. You can't deny it. Only clowns aren't funny anymore, they're the stars of horror movies, which also suits the Emmet Kelly of the White House (no offense to Emmet Kelly). Trump is just one big horror movie, only we're living it. Unlike the song, let's send OUT the clowns.
Summed it up beautifully and the democrats haven’t learned a thing, continuing to double down. Though I noticed recently a few are starting to get it. A bit late though
"Correcting someone for calling a billionaire squabble a girl fight doesn’t protect women. It protects the corrector’s fragile sense of moral superiority. It’s less about creating a more just world and more about ensuring everyone knows you’re the kind of person who cares about creating a more just world."
This. A thousand times, this. It's the difference between "virtue" and "virtue signalling".
i have been left of center all my life, and can catalogue all the good things that Democrats have brought to this country. like a cross between a nurse, a maid, and financial advisor, they come in and clean up messes, take care of the needy, and generally make things better. Sadly we are at times our own worst enemies... we vacillate between the petty bickering and pedantic word wars referenced here and giving speeches that sound like a graduate level economics class in a university. we cannot seem to come out with a powerful, focused, simple set of messages to wake up voters. i have been watching several documentaries on how German citizens were hypnotized into Nazism not just by what Hitler did and said, but by what the rest of the country did not do. just like here, the powerful business leaders thought that they were going to get richer, and that they could control him. the sane elements in the country did not push back with the force required. we are not either.
Robert, I have always been a big WWII fan, but I have been obsessed lately with reading diaries, videos, and news clippings to understand the people. I personally don't find Hitler that interesting, but the people he manipulated...there are lessons there.
I couldn't sleep last night so was watching yet another Nazi Germany documentary. One video explained the horror the Allied troops experienced when they found what was left of the living in the concentration camps. They were so horrified, that they forced German citizens to walk through the camps and witness the atrocities.
The video showed women AND children observing the carnage. You don't know shame until you observe the looks on their faces.
we are cut from the same cloth. i am fascinated by the history of how the world in general and Germany in particular got there. i am not all that interested in the battles, weaponry, or Hitler, but instead how people responded in that environment. incredible fortitude in the concentration camps, incredible selflessness and bravery on the part of the various resistance groups, women fighting in the Russian military knowing that if they were caught they would be summarily executed by the Germans... and the opportunism, the bad judgement and cowardness... the people in occupied areas fraternizing with the Germans, posing in their uniforms, etc. says so much about how people can be manipulated, how selfless they can be, how self centered they can be. i just watched the first part of a two or three part series taken from the diaries of 8 Germans, starting around 1935 or 35, talking about how they felt about Hitler... a very good mix of people, some angry or scared, some very supportive, some just trying to live their lives... really well done and given that it is from primary sources, it was free of opinions one way or another.. where we differ is i start watching these at night then fall asleep! but i do get caught up in the history and stay up a tad later than i should... it should be required viewing for any American... this will be you... pay attention to what is happening in LA, and now across the country... he will bring out troops against the law to put them down.. meanwhile spending a fortune on "his parade"... we are heading for a Feudal society i fear
Slippery slope. I largely agree, but is calling them "retards" ok? Clearly the line is situational to an extent, but you're going to hear some truly appalling shit just tossed out on a blue-collar jobsite. Do we just hear-no-evil because ICE is trampling the constitution and that has precedence or is a large part of the reason for the ICE nightmare because we've tolerated this too long?
I hate where we are as a country and we do have to pick our battles to some extent. We also know the game is rigged and the right applies rules very asymmetrically. Until the left is operating from a position of strength, these are the rules we're going to have to live with. I think AOC's comment was unfortunate. Mark my words, the right will use it against her and she won't have a response. With the way the scoring works these days, that will be a painful own-goal.
Let's not use this situation as an opportunity to backslide. No one wins there.
Retards? I didn't see anyone use that word in this comment thread.
Yes, it's hard to know which battles to fight, but messaging is very important as we approach the primaries. (Assuming we have them. Police states typically have "elections.")Unfortunately, the right will use AOC's words against her no matter what she says. But that's the thing...we have to stop being so careful. Harris ran a solid and very careful campaign.
Argues against linguistic policing by…uh…*checks notes*…linguistic policing. That’s going to work well.
If you’re looking to inspire psychological reactance, telling folks to “chill the fuck out” is probably the way to go.
I actually agree with you, yet reading this was still a reactive and nails-on-chalkboard experience. As you point out in your piece, loudly proclaiming people are wrong and bad for using incorrect language is not the way to get them to change their patterns. So, perhaps try another way next time.
Do you know the meaning of an ad hominem attack? Because your response suggests that you do not. Telling Dems to chill the fuck out is calling them out on their actions, not their character. Do better.
Then a rant against a guy who protested the use of the word clown, by using the word clown repeatedly.
Followed shortly by:
“when people feel judged, shamed, or patronized, they don’t come around to your point of view. They dig in against it.”
Again, I agree with so much of what you’re saying. But a big part of your premise seems to be that alienating people for their language is not serving the left. Yet you spend a lot of time alienating some Dems for their language, calling it “performative” and “moral grandstanding”. Again, I agree, it may very well be those things, and if your goal is to make those folks change by feeling shitty about themselves, okay, sure, shaming them is certainly a method. But it’s also the method you’re arguing against using throughout your piece. If you think that judging and shaming people for their linguistic choices doesn’t work - why are you doing it?
I suggest writing it in a way that doesn’t use blaming and angry language - exactly what you talked about as not working in your piece. If you address it from a place of understanding rather than reproaching people, they’re more likely to be receptive.
I did intake and a trans woman in the middle of transitioning volunteered this information as she knew her current appearance might be confusing and understood that medically and biologically, sex at birth is typically an important factor.
Most people seem reasonable, but the loud minority is having a detrimental effect as you wrote, and the most zealous don’t understand nuance or hypocrisy. It isn’t productive to be offended if someone who doesn’t know you fails to guess your pronouns, and once I know, it’s a small ask and I’m happy to oblige, but at the same time, they labeled heterosexual people (80% of those asked who answered identity as heterosexual globally) CIS.
I don’t really care, but it’s a double standard. A few times, I said I preferred to be referred to as heterosexual, and people explained to me that I was actually CIS. I don’t see that playing well in the opposite direction.
Just so you know - Cis doesn’t mean heterosexual, it means not transgender. “Cis” in Latin means “on the same side of” where “trans” means “on the opposite side of”. So if someone says you’re cis or cisgender they’re saying your gender is the same as the one you were assigned at birth.
If they were saying you’re cis, they weren’t talking about your sexuality, they were talking about your gender. You’re both heterosexual (attracted to the opposite sex) and cisgender (the same gender that you were assigned at birth).
A great article showing Carlyn’s impressive political acumen (which she showed before and I was expecting to see again, btw). She separates chaff from corn very correctly in my view and knows that the power of ridicule is maybe the best weapon to fight the Dangerous Clown. And her passionate fighting spirit is so inspiring. For an outsider (I’m naturalized Aussie) it’s encouraging to see how many positive responses the article provoked. It’s the USA citizens that have a fight at hand, a fight which outcome will have important consequences also for the rest of the world. People born and lived in Europe right after WW2 (like me) know well what Hitler’s or Stalin’s dictatorships were, that awareness was soaked in from everywhere around them. It is immensely important that Americans are reminded of the rise of these horrors, so as to see the similarities with what’s happening in front of their eyes and act before it’s too late. Bravo Carlyn.
I'm just saying, this sort of thing is what cost us Al Franken, one of the best and smartest senators EVER, due to an idiotic joke. Bad taste, maybe. Sexual harassment? No. Too high a price. 😕
I completely forgot about Al Franken. Which tells you why it was such an injustice.
Great article. I like the ending comment.
I'll add 1961 President John F Kennedy urges American citizens to participate in public service and "ask not what your country can do for you--ask what you can do for your country.
I'd hazard a guess that I'm at least as well traveled as "Clown Boy" and because I'm also a lifelong student of history I know that he's totally missing the point.
Clown Boy and that idiot who trashed Ms Ocasio-Cortez' perfect response to the Adderall v Ketamine Battle Royale seem to not understand a basic truth about strongman authoritarians (though for Their Donald "strong" needs to be in air quotes). The best and most effective way to resist them is through ridicule. They're fragile, profoundly insecure extremely vulnerable to ridicule.
In the short term, they'll flail about trying to break shit but in the long run, they prove that they are, I'm fact, clowns — and all you need is to let's a critical mass of the populace see it and boom! Their support evaporates.
This is how we neuter Trump — and we need to get on it before the Mid-Term election because a Democrat majority Congress is the best shield against Trump and his childish destruction.
I completely agree. Trump cannot stand to be mocked for a reason - he knows the power of humor. That's why I love the TACO memes. Exposing his buffoonery for what it is - the ramblings of a mad king - strips away his power.
Trump is a clown from the evil circus. Americans are suckers for this kind of show business. For Democrats to win they need to speak simple language people understand, don’t exaggerate small things like trans gender and don’t look down on someone less educated. Respect people who voted for Trump and work patiently with them to turn the tide. Maybe be a good clown with big heart vs bad cruel clown, would it work? We have to try in earnest.
Clown is as Clown does. You can't deny it. Only clowns aren't funny anymore, they're the stars of horror movies, which also suits the Emmet Kelly of the White House (no offense to Emmet Kelly). Trump is just one big horror movie, only we're living it. Unlike the song, let's send OUT the clowns.
Summed it up beautifully and the democrats haven’t learned a thing, continuing to double down. Though I noticed recently a few are starting to get it. A bit late though
"Correcting someone for calling a billionaire squabble a girl fight doesn’t protect women. It protects the corrector’s fragile sense of moral superiority. It’s less about creating a more just world and more about ensuring everyone knows you’re the kind of person who cares about creating a more just world."
This. A thousand times, this. It's the difference between "virtue" and "virtue signalling".
i have been left of center all my life, and can catalogue all the good things that Democrats have brought to this country. like a cross between a nurse, a maid, and financial advisor, they come in and clean up messes, take care of the needy, and generally make things better. Sadly we are at times our own worst enemies... we vacillate between the petty bickering and pedantic word wars referenced here and giving speeches that sound like a graduate level economics class in a university. we cannot seem to come out with a powerful, focused, simple set of messages to wake up voters. i have been watching several documentaries on how German citizens were hypnotized into Nazism not just by what Hitler did and said, but by what the rest of the country did not do. just like here, the powerful business leaders thought that they were going to get richer, and that they could control him. the sane elements in the country did not push back with the force required. we are not either.
Robert, I have always been a big WWII fan, but I have been obsessed lately with reading diaries, videos, and news clippings to understand the people. I personally don't find Hitler that interesting, but the people he manipulated...there are lessons there.
I couldn't sleep last night so was watching yet another Nazi Germany documentary. One video explained the horror the Allied troops experienced when they found what was left of the living in the concentration camps. They were so horrified, that they forced German citizens to walk through the camps and witness the atrocities.
The video showed women AND children observing the carnage. You don't know shame until you observe the looks on their faces.
we are cut from the same cloth. i am fascinated by the history of how the world in general and Germany in particular got there. i am not all that interested in the battles, weaponry, or Hitler, but instead how people responded in that environment. incredible fortitude in the concentration camps, incredible selflessness and bravery on the part of the various resistance groups, women fighting in the Russian military knowing that if they were caught they would be summarily executed by the Germans... and the opportunism, the bad judgement and cowardness... the people in occupied areas fraternizing with the Germans, posing in their uniforms, etc. says so much about how people can be manipulated, how selfless they can be, how self centered they can be. i just watched the first part of a two or three part series taken from the diaries of 8 Germans, starting around 1935 or 35, talking about how they felt about Hitler... a very good mix of people, some angry or scared, some very supportive, some just trying to live their lives... really well done and given that it is from primary sources, it was free of opinions one way or another.. where we differ is i start watching these at night then fall asleep! but i do get caught up in the history and stay up a tad later than i should... it should be required viewing for any American... this will be you... pay attention to what is happening in LA, and now across the country... he will bring out troops against the law to put them down.. meanwhile spending a fortune on "his parade"... we are heading for a Feudal society i fear
Slippery slope. I largely agree, but is calling them "retards" ok? Clearly the line is situational to an extent, but you're going to hear some truly appalling shit just tossed out on a blue-collar jobsite. Do we just hear-no-evil because ICE is trampling the constitution and that has precedence or is a large part of the reason for the ICE nightmare because we've tolerated this too long?
I hate where we are as a country and we do have to pick our battles to some extent. We also know the game is rigged and the right applies rules very asymmetrically. Until the left is operating from a position of strength, these are the rules we're going to have to live with. I think AOC's comment was unfortunate. Mark my words, the right will use it against her and she won't have a response. With the way the scoring works these days, that will be a painful own-goal.
Let's not use this situation as an opportunity to backslide. No one wins there.
Retards? I didn't see anyone use that word in this comment thread.
Yes, it's hard to know which battles to fight, but messaging is very important as we approach the primaries. (Assuming we have them. Police states typically have "elections.")Unfortunately, the right will use AOC's words against her no matter what she says. But that's the thing...we have to stop being so careful. Harris ran a solid and very careful campaign.
Argues against linguistic policing by…uh…*checks notes*…linguistic policing. That’s going to work well.
If you’re looking to inspire psychological reactance, telling folks to “chill the fuck out” is probably the way to go.
I actually agree with you, yet reading this was still a reactive and nails-on-chalkboard experience. As you point out in your piece, loudly proclaiming people are wrong and bad for using incorrect language is not the way to get them to change their patterns. So, perhaps try another way next time.
Do you know the meaning of an ad hominem attack? Because your response suggests that you do not. Telling Dems to chill the fuck out is calling them out on their actions, not their character. Do better.
It’s wild to me that you can’t see that the actions you claim are so divisive are identical to your own. Good luck with that.
Could you give me an example of such divisiveness? I will wait...
“Oh, please.”
“Chill. The. Fuck. Out.” (Repeatedly)
“Sanctimonious word policing”
Then a rant against a guy who protested the use of the word clown, by using the word clown repeatedly.
Followed shortly by:
“when people feel judged, shamed, or patronized, they don’t come around to your point of view. They dig in against it.”
Again, I agree with so much of what you’re saying. But a big part of your premise seems to be that alienating people for their language is not serving the left. Yet you spend a lot of time alienating some Dems for their language, calling it “performative” and “moral grandstanding”. Again, I agree, it may very well be those things, and if your goal is to make those folks change by feeling shitty about themselves, okay, sure, shaming them is certainly a method. But it’s also the method you’re arguing against using throughout your piece. If you think that judging and shaming people for their linguistic choices doesn’t work - why are you doing it?
What do you suggest?
I suggest writing it in a way that doesn’t use blaming and angry language - exactly what you talked about as not working in your piece. If you address it from a place of understanding rather than reproaching people, they’re more likely to be receptive.
I did intake and a trans woman in the middle of transitioning volunteered this information as she knew her current appearance might be confusing and understood that medically and biologically, sex at birth is typically an important factor.
Most people seem reasonable, but the loud minority is having a detrimental effect as you wrote, and the most zealous don’t understand nuance or hypocrisy. It isn’t productive to be offended if someone who doesn’t know you fails to guess your pronouns, and once I know, it’s a small ask and I’m happy to oblige, but at the same time, they labeled heterosexual people (80% of those asked who answered identity as heterosexual globally) CIS.
I don’t really care, but it’s a double standard. A few times, I said I preferred to be referred to as heterosexual, and people explained to me that I was actually CIS. I don’t see that playing well in the opposite direction.
Just so you know - Cis doesn’t mean heterosexual, it means not transgender. “Cis” in Latin means “on the same side of” where “trans” means “on the opposite side of”. So if someone says you’re cis or cisgender they’re saying your gender is the same as the one you were assigned at birth.
If they were saying you’re cis, they weren’t talking about your sexuality, they were talking about your gender. You’re both heterosexual (attracted to the opposite sex) and cisgender (the same gender that you were assigned at birth).
A great article showing Carlyn’s impressive political acumen (which she showed before and I was expecting to see again, btw). She separates chaff from corn very correctly in my view and knows that the power of ridicule is maybe the best weapon to fight the Dangerous Clown. And her passionate fighting spirit is so inspiring. For an outsider (I’m naturalized Aussie) it’s encouraging to see how many positive responses the article provoked. It’s the USA citizens that have a fight at hand, a fight which outcome will have important consequences also for the rest of the world. People born and lived in Europe right after WW2 (like me) know well what Hitler’s or Stalin’s dictatorships were, that awareness was soaked in from everywhere around them. It is immensely important that Americans are reminded of the rise of these horrors, so as to see the similarities with what’s happening in front of their eyes and act before it’s too late. Bravo Carlyn.